018: Remember God's Presence
Song-writer Ryan Stevenson joins us this week to talk about the comparison game, Fro-Yo flavors and the practice of stacking stones as we remember God’s story in our journey.
This week’s Practice:
Remember God’s Presence
+ 018 Remember God's Presence - Ryan Stevenson Transcript
Tim: All right everybody, Tim Timmons here with another 10000 MINUTE Experiment.
Chris: I'm real sad you didn't record anything.
Tim: I just [crosstalk 00:00:08]
Emmoe: Never question Tim.
Tim: Yeah, well that was Chris Cleveland.
Chris: What's up?
Tim: Hey Chris.
Chris: Hey. [crosstalk 00:00:17] We've never done that ever.
Tim: Hey.
Emmoe: You guys act like you were part of a frat back in the day.
Chris: Phi Gamma Delta. Let's go.
Tim: Did that just come out of your... Where'd that come from? Did you know somebody that was in something like that?
Chris: I was in a fraternity for a little while. Guys let's not talk about it.
Tim: No, let's, let us.
Emmoe: Oh my goodness.
Chris: Wore a lot of express button down shirts, loafers. It was a different time guys.
Emmoe: We might have to do a-
Chris: We'll see if we can find some photos [crosstalk 00:00:46]
Tim: Okay, so you give me crap about my songs, so I'm going to now find pictures of you.
Chris: I've still got that Tim Timmons CD sitting at my desk, so [crosstalk 00:00:56]
Tim: Three copies left.
Chris: Let's go.
Tim: All right, Emmoe Doniz.
Emmoe: Hi, oops. Hello, I didn't mean to uncover something like that. I was just kidding.
Tim: Then to my left, we've got the Ryan Stevenson.
Ryan: The one and only.
Tim: [crosstalk 00:01:11] Yeah. Are there a bunch of Ryan Stevensons? Is that like a pretty common name?
Ryan: Well I'm learning that there are a bunch of us out there.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: Because every time somebody accidentally tags one of the other Ryan Stevensons on social media, those guys end up hitting me up and we have this kind of like weird interaction. And they're like, why are all these Christian music fans tagging me to play soccer?
Tim: Yeah yeah yeah yeah. Are there any total characters?
Ryan: There are some, there are. There's one dude in particular, Ryan Stevenson, if you're listening [crosstalk 00:01:45] my Canadian counterpart.
Tim: Right, right, right.
Ryan: He's definitely, I would not say that he's in the CCM space.
Tim: Right, that's Contemporary Christian Music [inaudible 00:01:55]
Ryan: By looking at his videos and his content.
Tim: Have you seen Chris's content? Sorry, keep going, keep going.
Ryan: But every time people accidentally tag him.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: Or they are looking for me and they find him.
Chris: Yeah.
Ryan: People are looking for Ryan Stevenson, the guy who sings Eye of the Storm, and then they go out and looking for Ryan Stevenson and they find Ryan Stevenson in Canada.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: With like tatted from head to toe, and the skin tight white tank top, and the content that's in his [crosstalk 00:02:31] videos. I think it's always a nice interesting surprise for people who are looking for me and find him.
Tim: Yeah. Yeah. Well that's so funny because this week we're talking about tattoos in the spiritual ramifications, so.
Chris: Are we? Great. Sweet. This is going to be awesome.
Emmoe: This is why we get canceled, guys I'm not ready, man. [inaudible 00:02:53]
Tim: Emmoe Doniz, you don't have too many Emmoe Doniz's, are there other Emmoe Doniz's?
Emmoe: No.
Chris: I've never even heard of another one.
Emmoe: I haven't either. There aren't others.
Tim: Are there other Emmoes?
Emmoe: No, I mean maybe. I mean rumor has it, because my family's so big there are rumors.
Tim: Yeah.
Emmoe: That my dad met someone in the elevator with my name and that's how he liked my name. Other people say I have a cousin that has that name. I've never met her. So I don't know what's real.
Tim: Gosh, in this world.
Chris: How many Tim Timmons are there? Tim Timmonses?
Tim: There aren't a lot of us, but one was... is an umpire.
Chris: Okay.
Tim: In the major leagues.
Chris: Yes, I saw that the other day.
Tim: I get hate mail from that guy. Because everybody's like "You bastard, you." I get full on hate mail from Tim Timmons, the umpire. So Tim Timmons the umpire, if you're listening.
Chris: This is great.
Tim: I think you're doing great.
Chris: Like there's a actor named Chris Cleveland and he was in The Prestige, and I'm pretty sure that we get each other's email every once in a while, because I think he's just chriscleveland@gmail.com. You know what I mean?
Tim: Strong.
Chris: It's pretty amazing.
Emmoe: Solid.
Chris: So yeah. There's [inaudible 00:04:04] of us out there.
Tim: Well speaking of names, Ryan Stevenson.
Ryan: Sir.
Emmoe: Welcome.
Ryan: Thank you guys for having me.
Tim: [foreign language 00:04:13] that means welcome in Spanish.
Emmoe: That's all of you, welcome. [crosstalk 00:04:18] all his forms. All you Ryan Stevensons, welcome.
Tim: So can I not say be [foreign language 00:04:22] to one person?
Emmoe: You say [foreign language 00:04:26]
Chris: Get rid of that thing.
Emmoe: I'm ruining everyone's day. I'm so sorry guys. I'll stop talking.
Tim: At some point I do need to tell my story of my translating story.
Emmoe: Oh yes. That will bless many.
Tim: That will be another time because that would be really inappropriate. Inappropriate. Well speaking of inappropriate, tattoos Ryan.
Ryan: Yeah.
Tim: Would you have any?
Ryan: Yeah, I got a couple.
Tim: Well, like lower back?
Ryan: Like the stamp [crosstalk 00:04:55] Just like a dolphin [inaudible 00:04:58] the sunset. I have a full lower back stamp wrapped around barbed wire.
Chris: Uuh, I love that.
Ryan: Tribal barbed wire.
Chris: That's like cool in '97 meets like-
Ryan: It was my first tattoo. I'm just kidding.
Tim: Thorns, crown of thorns.
Ryan: I have some tattoos.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: I got my first tattoo when I was 18. I was in college, I was away from mommy and daddy for the first time. I was just cut loose in the amazing city of Eugene, Oregon. Where this... If you know anything about [crosstalk 00:05:33] If you know anything about Eugene man, anyhow, I was messing around on my binder one day and I was drawing all these designs and I drew this cool design of a cross and I was like, "You know what? I'm going to go get that."
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: Tattooed on my shoulder. So that's what I did.
Tim: Yeah. Watch me rebel parents.
Ryan: Oh man. And I remember I pierced my tongue, I bleached my hair jet white.
Chris: Oh man.
Ryan: With literally like this peroxide kind of-
Chris: Who's your favorite band at this point?
Tim: That's a valid question.
Ryan: Well, I mean, I was like... It was probably Sublime or Sugar Ray or... I was totally into hip hop and that late '90s, early 2000s just pop stuff.
Chris: I love it, takes me right there.
Ryan: Man, I go get tatted up and everybody was warning me. They're like, "Hey man, if you start getting tattoos, it's really hard to just get one and just stop there." And so I think 30 later.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: So I've been getting tattoos for 20 years.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: And I think I've got a lot of them now. I wouldn't say I'm sleeved.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: But I have enough to... And I'm kind of at the point now where my wife doesn't necessarily like them, but we've been together so long and I always get them when I'm out on the road tour.
Chris: Yeah, there you go.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: And I can kind of sneak them in now because there's so many that if I get a little one [crosstalk 00:07:00]
Tim: That's hilarious.
Ryan: I don't really tell her anymore. I just come home and six months will go by and she's like, "Hey, when did you get that?" I'm like, "Oh baby, I've had this for like a year. [crosstalk 00:07:12] That's so old.
Tim: I'm so glad she's not going to listen to this.
Chris: Pretty much the opposite of Kenzie and I. She's like... Kenzie just shows up with new tattoos all the time. And I stopped asking or I'm like, "Babe, you're going to do it. So just go get it. Don't tell me."
Tim: The addiction's real.
Chris: Yeah, it is.
Tim: Well, speaking of the addiction.
Emmoe: Why are you looking at me? I don't have any, I don't have any
Tim: But would you?
Emmoe: I would, I have been wanting to, but I don't like doing things alone. So I'm like, "Who else wants tatted with me?"
Tim: Guys, this is your turn, everybody here.
Chris: Press pause.
Emmoe: But my best friend just moved into town and she's like, "I'll go get them with you." So the plan is next month. So I'll be joining the gang.
Tim: This is right real.
Chris: Are you just going to get Doniz on the back?
Ryan: Doniz suckers.
Emmoe: Well, rumor has it we were Donizetti, so I'll get that instead. No, no, I'm just kidding.
Chris: That sounds more Italian though.
Emmoe: This is why I also want to go get it with someone, because I keep messing up which flower I want to get. So I want to get a dandelion. Nope, daffodil. See, there I go. There I go.
Chris: Oh shoot, you're bad. [crosstalk 00:08:15]
Ryan: You do know what a dandelion is? [crosstalk 00:08:19]
Emmoe: Daffodil, so daffodil's the flower of my birth month, which is also my brothers, and so it would be in memory of my brother, but I'm scared of it.
Chris: You need to print out the photo you want. [crosstalk 00:08:29]
Emmoe: And I'm like, this is August. I didn't mean to do this. [crosstalk 00:08:31] So I need to go with someone or I'm going to mess it up.
Tim: That's hilarious.
Ryan: It would be amazing if you accidentally got a dandelion.
Emmoe: That's what I'm saying. I'm like, I can't go by myself. I got the wrong month, whoop, anyhow.
Tim: Well that's going to be a great episode. We need to talk about that.
Ryan: I did it guys. I [crosstalk 00:08:51]
Emmoe: [inaudible 00:08:51] is going to be [inaudible 00:08:52] part two. No, this is [crosstalk 00:08:53]
Tim: Part two, totally. Okay, well enough dummery.
Emmoe: Yeah, cut it out guys.
Tim: This is so stupid. We'll cut most of that. JK JK.
Ryan: Oh wait. Isn't this about tattoos?
Tim: Hey everybody. Thank you so much for listening to this 10,000 Minute Experiment podcast and we are 18 years old. This episode is episode 18, so we can legally vote. And if you've been with us for a while, you could legally vote because speaking of voting, if you want to like this, comment on this, or subscribe to this, that would be super helpful for us, so please do that. I just want to give a shout out to Jim C, and to Cole, and Anna for jumping in to partnering with us financially. So some of you guys are doing monthly. Some of you are one time things, but this isn't cheap, and we love what we're doing. So if this is helpful for you and you've got the ability to support us and walk with us, please do. We're working on an email right now to send out with video updates on things we're doing to people that are partnering with us and for the new things that we're moving towards.
Tim: So go to 10000minutes.com and go up in the upper right, it says donate and join us. Also, if you guys want to get free text messages, you can text 10K, one zero K to the number 55678, 10K to 55678. And if you have any other thoughts on things that you'd love for us to jump into, please let us know. So this week we've got my friend Ryan Stevenson and please check out his music. He also has a great podcast called Weathering the Storm that I'm actually on in a few weeks. I think you're going to love this episode. Here we go.
Tim: So this week with the [inaudible 00:10:34] Chaka Khan, the 10000 Minute Experiment, we are practicing The Presence of God and what that looks like. It's an old book, Brother Lawrence.
Ryan: I love it. I love Brother Lawrence.
Tim: And I read that when I was like four.
Ryan: Of course.
Tim: But it is so profound, the idea. I didn't really read it when I was four.
Emmoe: I know. You just lied to the people.
Tim: You guys can't see my fingers, but it's-
Ryan: It's a tiny little book.
Tim: It's a tiny little book.
Emmoe: Yeah. It was college requirement.
Tim: But a powerful little idea for sure. And it stuck with me obviously for a long time because that's kind of the point of 10,000 Minutes is really practicing the presence, joining Jesus in my life instead of working for him or just doing it on Sunday morning. So Ryan, just a question for you. I've got two, and the hope here is not to get all cool and Christiany, which I love about you because you won't get all cool and Christiany. It's truly something I love about you is that you are not the antithesis of that, but you have kind of fought for just being the Ryan Stevenson, like who God has made you in this moment. There's not a lot of BS that comes out of your mouth, which I really have appreciated over the years and still do even us at the fire the other night. You are just... you're a good friend, and that sounds really weird. We we're at a bonfire the other night, but [crosstalk 00:11:56]
Tim: Yeah. Yeah. We're arsonists as well. Anyways, so part of this is saying, are there any practices or rhythms that you've put in your life at certain points in your life. Not even the, "Well, you know what I do every day, I do this." And we might, which would be amazing, but in your life, have there been any practices or rhythms that you've put into your days that have helped you just stay in the awareness of Jesus, of joining Jesus?
Ryan: Yeah. And I wouldn't say that I get right up in the morning and I dive into the word and I have this routine, but
Tim: Next.
Ryan: Yeah, so thanks for having me today.
Chris: Could Bart come back?
Tim: Right? Right.
Emmoe: Just give him a chance guys.
Ryan: I feel like definitely something that has been just a part of my moment by moment awareness is right when I get up in the morning, I started doing it years ago as I just, I immediately have my mind just go to a place where I am just aware that God you're with me, I'm your son. Even if I just don't even feel like it. If I'm not feeling a thing, and I'm stressed, or I'm heavy or it feels like my world is melting down, I just try to really be deliberate and intentional of starting my day. Just being aware that God is it, because I feel like if you start there, you're already setting the tone in a way for just where your mind and your head space is going to be throughout the day. And I know that that's such a simple little thing, but it really does help me. Before my feet even get out the bed, I wake up in the morning, whether my alarm goes off or one of my kids wakes me up and I'm just like, Jesus.
Tim: Right.
Ryan: Thank you that I woke up and God just be near.
Tim: I love that. So in our sober moments and I'm using sober very specifically, not legitimately drunk sober. I just mean when I'm more aware of reality in life, we can practice these things. When we're more drunk on fear or worry or whatever, we forget these things. So what pulls you out of the awareness of Jesus? Either in the mornings when you wake up, you're like, nope.
Ryan: Yeah.
Tim: What pulls you out of those things?
Ryan: I would say it is fear. It's focus and giving my attention to the stinking thinking. It's things that haven't even manifested. It's the what ifs. It's not living in the present, it's living either... I spend a lot of my time living in the past or in the future. I think that's something that we all struggle with, is living right here right now in the moment, being thankful for today. I guess to answer your question, the things that really jar me out of my peace in being still in those moments, in the presence of God is wondering what if or the fear.
Tim: Give me an example of something that pulls you out.
Ryan: Comparison, the comparison game, bad. My journey has been so weird, and so quirky, and so crazy and just not a very pretty sexy journey into this space that I'm in now.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: It's been hard, and it's been a fight, and it's been beautiful all at the same time. And we've had victory, and we've had defeat, and we've had amazing seasons and gut wrenching hopeless seasons. And so I think that because I already deal with profound insecurity, it gives me a propensity to navigate my day from a posture of inadequacy.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: From defeat.
Tim: Yeah.
Chris: Yeah.
Ryan: And so it doesn't take much for me to look on social media and see everybody is so dope, and they're so good, and they're so successful. And it has a tendency to just squash and put me in a place in my heart, and in my thoughts like it doesn't matter how hard I work, or how much success I get, I'm never going to be that person. And look how easy it is for everybody else, and look how hard it is for me. It's like, those are the things that really rattle me out of my peace for sure.
Tim: That literally makes you drunk on those things so much that your awareness is [crosstalk 00:16:04]
Ryan: Yeah.
Chris: I was just going to say, I literally posted on Instagram yesterday the exact same thing. Because I was just going through my day fine, and then all of a sudden and I'm sitting there with my wife, this piece of information comes into my brain, I put my phone down, I was like, I got to go. And I walked outside, walked around for like half an hour. It was like, all of that hit me at once.
Ryan: Yeah.
Chris: I've got a new record coming out and all this stuff. And I realized all the things that I can't control and that are out of my hands. And then start comparing to all these other things, same thing that you're doing. And it just put me in the worst space and I'm fighting against this, trying to talk to my wife. I'm like, can be sober enough in the moment to realize what's happening, but then still at this point in life where it's like, I still can't get over it.
Ryan: Yeah.
Chris: So I feel like I still don't have the tools to deal with it. I know what's happening. Whether that's an encouragement to you or not.
Ryan: I feel like it is, because I feel like one of the biggest tactics of the enemy, if you will, is to get us isolated. At least what he does with me is just that whispering in my ear that you are alone. You're the only one who feels like this. Everybody else is fine, but you. It's like that isolation, compartmentalization can be paralyzing, for me anyways.
Tim: Chris, in that moment you went on a walk and you came back like knowing what was happening, but couldn't fix it. Talk about that.
Chris: Yeah. I think I was able to say, "Okay, here's what's happening to me." Spiraling out on something that I have zero control in, but I still couldn't change my mood about it. And my wife, she knows me well enough at this point where she kind of takes a step back, make sure I'm okay, and reassures me in whatever way she can. But then I just think it takes time, and for me I've just got to work through it and get over it and then change my perspective and realize all the things I do have. So that was one of the things that I started going through, it was like, I sat on my porch for a second and just listened. I was trying to find God in the moment. It actually made me think what's the presence of God right now?
Chris: And then some sort of thankful or grateful list of, "Wow God, you've provided for us in all these ways and blah, blah, blah." Because what's the worst... Where does this take me? What's the worst scenario that just takes me down? And maybe it's that no one likes me and I can't support my family or whatever. So then you start building back on that, but it doesn't make the feeling go away.
Tim: Right.
Chris: It's not like a quick fix, but I think we can all find perspective and find God still in the midst of it.
Tim: Just for fun in your actions, in that moment, in that 30-minute walk, what would you have believed to be true about yourself?
Chris: If I'm completely honest.
Tim: Completely honest.
Chris: I think that I was more of in a pity party. I deserve this because I've worked so hard. Why is my journey, like what you're saying, why is my road harder than this person's road?
Tim: Yeah.
Chris: Or why can't I have this or do this. So it was really more of like a gosh, a little pity party for myself.
Tim: Yeah.
Chris: That I needed to snap out of a bit.
Tim: Yeah. What did you believe to be true about God in that moment? When you're drunk in those moments of comparison?
Chris: He doesn't dish out things fairly.
Tim: Huh? Right. Totally.
Chris: That life doesn't happen equally to the same measure of goodness to everyone.
Tim: Yeah.
Chris: And I still might think that. Yeah. So that might just be true.
Tim: And what would your identity be in that moment, in a drunk moment?
Chris: Yeah. Just worthless.
Tim: Yeah. And then what would you believe to be true about other people?
Chris: Oh gosh.
Tim: Like their view of you equals what part of your identity?
Chris: I guess it doesn't matter as much.
Tim: Huh.
Chris: Yeah. In that drunk moment.
Tim: Yeah. Yeah.
Chris: Although I must have tricked this person into liking me or my mom thinks I can sing good or whatever it is.
Emmoe: [inaudible 00:20:18]
Chris: So you discount the good, and you amplify those negative voices in your head.
Tim: That is so true. We discount the good and we amplify those negative voices is in our heads, right? So if we're not practicing the presence of God and listening to his voice and his heart for us, we jump into comparison, envy, greed, contempt. I'm better than somebody else. We're quick to act and slow to speak, slow to listen. What voices are you listening to this week? Who has your attention?
Tim: We talk about this all the time. Our friend Kevin has just jacked me up with this way of looking at things. And I'm always trying to look at everything through these lenses of like, "Dang, I know what I believe in my heart or my thoughts, my theology." But really my life is just showing such a different theology. And at the bottom of it is my identity. If yesterday you were able to... If your identity was so secure and like, "Oh dude, God's at work and all these cool things and I get to play a part of it. And I'm loved like, yeah."
Chris: Which normally, especially the last year or so has been where I've been.
Tim: Yeah.
Chris: And it was so strange because... and I've done a lot of work to get there. And then this one thing, I was like, "What!"
Tim: Yeah,
Emmoe: Yeah. That's real.
Chris: Are you kidding me? And then I'm like, "Well, what happened to the last year and a half of good work that's happened?" And it's crazy how quickly-
Tim: So fast
Chris: That can flip. Yeah.
Tim: And I'm not dogging you going [crosstalk 00:22:04] all you need to do is [crosstalk 00:22:09] All you need to do is get to this place and then everything's great. It just interesting to like observe it from the outside as if we're looking at it in a box. Ryan for you is do you think about the comparison game, let's say. Because if that's something that kind of... one of the things that throws you out of just living in the presence of God. Part of living in the presence of God is knowing who you are in the presence of God as well. What do you believe to be true about others in that scenario?
Ryan: It's kind of like what Chris was saying. It's so easy to look at our situation and feel like I got to work harder than everybody else.
Tim: Right.
Ryan: And everybody else gets it so easy. It's like I start to covet other people's journey when I just don't even realize how amazing, and how gracious, and how beautiful the Lord has just been so near in my own journey, if I just step back. I mean, I just, I resonate with what you're saying Chris about if you just get out and take a 40,000 foot view of your life, of my life. You know I worked as a paramedic for years and I always think about... When I start acting like a baby, and when I just start getting emo, and I'm just like having a pity party and I'm like, "Oh my, la la la la la." I know the narrative. I know the tapes that are going on in my head. And then I start to think, man, I've seen a lot of death. I have had my hands in a lot of situations
Tim: You got crazy stories. Yeah.
Ryan: People... I've seen people die countless times. I've intervened in situations where people's lives were ripped to pieces literally and metaphorically. I've seen addiction, rape, murder, suicide, you name it. And that's other people's, I've seen great loss. I've bore witness to the tragedy and the darkness of humanity.
Tim: Wow.
Ryan: Right in my face. And I did that for years. And now I play music for a living, and I have three kids, and I get to be on tour buses, and I fly around the world. And when I get to this point in a musical journey and in my comparison world, in social media, I immediately start to snap and think I could be on the freeway helping scrape up bodies. Or be in trailer parks facing suicides and heroin overdoses and a myriad of things that I've actually... It's a perspective.
Ryan: When I think about it in the context of this is reality, this is a reality for a lot of people. And it was my reality for almost nine years. And this is what I'm doing now, it makes it easier to just say, "Gosh, pull your head out." I mean, live in some reality, stop this whole immature complaining thing. Then I think about our brothers and sisters all around the world.
Tim: Right.
Ryan: That, and especially in this last season. My heart has been like, how dare I even remotely gripe and complain about something that's not happening in my musical world when my brothers and sisters are being drug out into the streets and executed and put into cages and persecuted to the highest degree for owning a Bible, for our faith in the Lord. And here I am in our amazing country and I'm safe, and I have everything that I could ever want. And I'm griping about somebody getting an opportunity that I should have had while my brothers and sisters are being persecuted and they're being executed for their... Just saying that they believe in Jesus. That is major conviction for me. And I want to live... I want stay right there.
Tim: Yeah. Yeah. How do you stay there and not go to a shame place?
Ryan: Yeah. I think it's just having grace for ourselves and I feel like I'm learning that more and more because I used to immediately just wallow and chin like, "Oh God, I'm so sorry." I know.
Tim: I Suck. I suck.
Ryan: Yeah. I suck. Oh my gosh. [crosstalk 00:26:26] Now it's like, "Okay Lord, you know what, I'm sorry." I feel like the older I get, the more I'm being aware of how Abba feels about me as his son, because I know how I feel about my boys. There's nothing they could do that would... They should never go to a place of shame with me. On their nastiest, dirtiest, filthiest, most mouthy complaining, horrible day. I don't ever want them to feel shame. I want them to run to me.
Tim: Such a good visual.
Ryan: And that's how I feel like Abba feels about us, in my places of insecurity and shame. I feel like He just wants us to comes straight to Him and not wallow in shame, but say, "Hey son, but how about we? How about we think about that a little bit different?"
Chris: Yeah.
Ryan: That's where I'm starting to go now, because I just feel like my heart is changing. My life has changed in the last year as you and I have talked. And it's becoming easier the more I grow in my relationship with Jesus, the more I'm just... I feel like everything is completely flipping from me to a place of duty and works and the treadmill of performance, and the comparison game to a posture of, "Oh, that's my dad." And when I crash and burn, and when I mess up, or when I get dirty, I'm really starting not to wallow in the shame and the guilt and all the things that come with that and just come to my dad's lap and just say, "Abba, thank you for loving me and being so fascinated with me even in my filth." And it starts to change. It really does shift your perspective. And it makes you have a lot of grace for everybody else.
Tim: Yeah. Yeah. When, when we can get to those places, those are sober moments. I have two thoughts, one is just you were talking about being in the presence of God. I think as Jesus is always saying repent, repent, which is rethink your thinking, not what we've always thought it was. But it's rethink your thinking on all these things. I mean, you are in this season, rethink, try and rethink your thinking on things. And I think we do that best when we're walking with and in the presence of Jesus. The other thing I was thinking about that's just a different twist on this is that our view of God dictates so much of whether I want to be in the presence of God, like practicing being in the presence. Some people might be like, "Well, being in the presence of that, God, the God that I have in my mind. No thank you."
Chris: Going to the principal's office or something.
Tim: Totally. Where versus what Ryan's saying is like me as a dad, when my kids come to me or they do something stupid, I'm never like "You idiot."
Chris: Right.
Tim: You know I might go, "That sucks, and that was not awesome." But I don't want you to go to shame, man.
Emmoe: Exactly.
Tim: Just that heart of the father is such a different heart than I think many people and all of us see God at the presence of God is like, "Oh crap. I don't want to go there. What's he going to make me do or rethink? Or am I Africa? Am I going to have to just-"
Chris: So like the first step in being present to God is like having a right view of who God is.
Tim: I think that's what discipleship is. I don't think it's a program or a book we go through. It's this, it's us just having conversations that are helping us reframe our view of a real God.
Chris: I mean, even as Ryan was talking right there, I could feel a weight from me from the last day lifting off. I'm like, "God, yeah, yeah." And it just feels... I feel lighter, I feel better. It's nice to share experience, and you can say that, like when you're going through those moments, you can say, "Okay, I know what this is. I know that my friends feel this too and blah, blah, blah." But it really does help to voice it and to sit down and talk it out.
Tim: Oh, my gosh.
Ryan: I think ultimately, man, this is the conclusion that I'm coming to is I have to be rooted and established in the fact that I'm just beloved. Every single thing in our life, I'm learning this, is just a secondary consequence to being established in our beloved identity as kids of the king. If we don't get that right, and I've been to the church my whole life, and I'm just now at 40 years old, finally relearning and being repositioned and reseated, like seated in a place of just... I'm just a son. That's my dad, and first it's really unnerving because you start to think these thoughts like, "Well, gosh, what if I just lose everything? Or what if I just don't focus on this and this and this and this, and I'm not task-oriented anymore, then I'm not going to get anything done and I'm not going to... I'm a worker and I have ambition.
Ryan: No, I'm learning now to scale everything back and to just sit and be seated. Not that I stop working or do anything, but my heart's motivation is not doing this and this and this and this. It's like everything that I'm doing now, I'm doing from a place of rest and being seated in my identity as a son. And I'm for one reason or the other, I feel like I'm finding more peace, and rest, and health, and relational value with other people, and not beating down the door of task.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: But just approaching everything from a point of I'm just resting. And at the end of the day, I think we all need to ask ourself, and this is what I've been asking myself particularly out of this season that we've all been in, in this last shutdowns and all the things that are so polarizing right now that we can talk about the rest of the day. As a Christian, as an ambassador of Christ, as an image bearer and as a light bearer, as a city set on the hill, what is your life worth? What does it actually mean if everything goes away and you don't have anything that you love so much right now and you cling to, and that we put all of our effort and energy and our focus on, what is actually important in your life? It's your relationships, it's your family, it's your children, it's your wife, it's your spouse, it's your community.
Ryan: I'm taking everything there. I'm stripping everything down to a point where what if I lose my record deal, if I lose my vehicles, if I lose my... What do I have? I have people, I have my relationship with Jesus, and my relationship with others. And that really honestly should be enough, and we're getting an opportunity and all I know I'm getting long-winded.
Tim: You're doing great.
Ryan: I feel like we're all getting up close and personal amazing opportunity right now in this season we've all been in to actually be Christians, to actually live out our faith, to be mouthpieces and ambassadors of light. Because we've been really, and I'm talking to myself man. I've been guilty of being complacent and jaded and just indifferent and letting things slide and letting things go for the sake of, well I don't want to ruffle any feathers. I feel like we're in a different time now where, Christians especially, we get an opportunity to live out a wild, radical faith right now in real time. And everything else should be secondary, honestly.
Tim: I love all of that. And I think there's so much there to rethink our thinking on, just daily. So when we're drunk, I don't see this beautiful reality that you're talking about right now. Most of the stuff is amazing, and then we go... Something happens and then we just get thrown off. What is some kind of practice of the awareness of Jesus, presence of God? Is there some kind of practice or thing that you do or anybody in this group does that kind of pulls us back and goes, "All right, take a deep breath." What is that thing? Is there a thing that you guys have noticed that works for you to then get you to that place of sobriety of like, what's really going on here? How are we really representing Jesus, the light of the world?
Ryan: I mean I can answer that really easy, for me, like what I was saying to you Chris, when I think about all the things that I could complain about and all the things that I don't have in my need or my wants, or my desires or any of that when I start wallowing in a place of deficit. I think it's just remembering and being conscious and aware. The Bible talks about that so much about remembering, remembering the pillars, not forgetting these things, but remember where you come from, go back to the place of that first altar, go back to the altar and remember what I've done and where I've brought you. I think we need to
Tim: Love that.
Ryan: literally come back to the places of those altars, where we remember, and we live in remembrance and reminder of how good He is and what He's done in our lives.
Tim: Yeah. Ryan's talking about when in the Old Testament, God would have the Israelites stack stones as alters to be reminders to them and to the generations to come of God's nearness in his work, in the midst of all things. Remember back in episode five with Susie Lynn, she said, how often we forget to remember all that God's done. We forget to remember. So where are the stacked stone moments in your life? And if you're in desperate need of remembering right now, this is perfect for you. And if you're skating through life at this moment, this is a great practice because manure happens. So as we sit in the presence of God, where are the stacked stone moments in your life. Let's practice remembering. That's such a good practice. And I think for me, and I don't know if this is for everybody, but I do that better when I'm with people. I
Ryan: Think that's true.
Chris: I think it's true. I think, for instance, back to my yesterday, I needed a second by myself just to get over the pity party part of it. And then I think then coming into community with my wife, having this conversation, those are the things when you can actually put perspective, like real perspective around it. Because I can tell myself the things over and over.
Tim: Totally.
Chris: I need to feel it too. And I think that's what community does. Is just helps you feel it. Because sometimes we don't trust our own voice, or the things that we know.
Tim: Sometimes for me it doesn't become real until I say it out loud to people, it's just in my head.
Ryan: I think too things... Like when you said it doesn't become real, something that makes my situation feel not so dire is just knowing that somebody else has gone through it too. I say it all the time, from stage or in our concerts or whatever, one of the most transformative moments of my life was... The times I've been healed the most in my own personal life is when I've heard other men and women just get up and confess and talk about what's actually happening in their life because the Bible says our confession brings healing. Confess your sins one to another. There's something that takes place, there's a life, and there's a healing that takes place inside of our testimony and our confession and our story that I kind of agree with what you guys are saying is that I do too need kind of a minute alone where I'm just like, "Oh."
Tim: Yeah, right.
Ryan: Kind of processing some things in my head. But when I get with people and I get my energy from people, I'm such a people-person, I'm so relationally driven that to me, I feel like I heal and move through things when I'm around other people who can just feel it too. I have to feel it.
Tim: Well, thank you, Ryan.
Ryan: I'm honored, man. I hope I didn't get super long-winded on you today.
Tim: You did, and we've got extensive [inaudible 00:39:08] for you.
Chris: It's going to be great. Actually your wife is outside.
Ryan: Yeah. I hear her honking, hurry up.
Tim: [inaudible 00:39:15] Okay. Ryan, what are you... No, I like your wife a lot. Okay, Ryan now is the time when we're going to get real serious.
Ryan: Okay.
Chris: Uh-oh.
Ryan: It's called 10,000 thoughts with Ryan Stevenson. The one with not as many tattoos.
Chris: Be careful.
Ryan: That's the whole, I think that's the title of it. 10,000 thoughts with the real Ryan Stevenson with not as many tattoos.
Chris: Pre tats
Tim: So here's the deal. We're going to give you a bunch of words, and you give us the first thing that comes to your mind.
Ryan: I'm just going to warn you.
Tim: No, no. It's okay. It's okay. We can, we can beep the-
Emmoe: The first answer is the right answer.
Tim: Jason Gray had some good beeps earlier, so I think we're doing great. So guys, you can jump in too. I've got just a few that I'm just going to check out there.
Ryan: Cool.
Tim: Ryan, are you ready?
Ryan: Yeah, let's do it.
Tim: [inaudible 00:40:08]
Emmoe: Remember, remember.
Ryan: What was that word?
Tim: That's the word. What do you think I said?
Emmoe: Yeah. Now we're playing telephone.
Tim: Remember this is a quick, quick draw.
Ryan: Okay. Quick round.
Tim: Quick round. When I dance, I look like
Ryan: Michael Jackson
Tim: Oh my gosh, is that true?
Ryan: No.
Tim: [inaudible 00:40:32] the first thing that popped in your mind?
Ryan: But I always try.
Tim: Yeah, gosh, the '90s
Ryan: Saved by the Bell
Chris: Yeah. [crosstalk 00:40:41] Let's go.
Ryan: The best decade to be alive ever in opinion.
Chris: I'm so glad that we're all in our 30s, at least.
Emmoe: Hello, I'm in my 30 you guys. [crosstalk 00:40:51] all the time.
Tim: [crosstalk 00:40:54] I'm in my 20s. Wow. Anybody? Three favorite movies.
Ryan: Dumb & Dumber, Shawshank Redemption, Point Break
Chris: [inaudible 00:41:01] I love the breadth of that.
Tim: Yes. It's so true. Just stupid humor, genius, powerful, emotional, and then action packed [crosstalk 00:41:16]
Ryan: Gary Busey, I could just watch it over and over [crosstalk 00:41:20] I have them all memorized.
Tim: Gosh, okay.
Chris: Here for it.
Tim: Favorite song you didn't write.
Ryan: Like?
Tim: Besides one of Chris and I songs, don't patronize us.
Ryan: Oh my gosh, man. I love so many songs.
Tim: I know. Give two or three.
Ryan: Someone You loved Lewis Capaldi
Chris: Oh, it's such a good song.
Ryan: Oh my gosh.
Chris: Come on Ryan.
Tim: You're doing great.
Ryan: How about Dua Lipa Levitating?
Emmoe: The baselines on that album.
Tim: Dated her, perfect.
Ryan: Doja Cat Say So [crosstalk 00:41:58] there's my top. There's my three that I wish I would've [crosstalk 00:42:03]
Tim: Strong.
Chris: I also appreciate that they're all within [crosstalk 00:42:05]
Emmoe: Well made melodies, well made melodies.
Ryan: Or Hotel California [crosstalk 00:42:12]
Tim: Anybody got a guitar? Anybody? Are we a guitar center? So if you're getting fro-yo
Ryan: I haven't had sugar in 15 years, but okay.
Tim: You haven't had sugar in 15 years?
Chris: This is what that looks like. Oh my gosh.
Ryan: Can you see my rib gauge?
Tim: So have you not had sugar in 15 years?
Ryan: No. I used to weigh 300 pounds, bro. So I stopped eating bread and sugar when I was 25.
Chris: Wow.
Ryan: 26, so I have not been to... I haven't had ice cream or frozen yogurt in-
Tim: Oh buddy.
Ryan: I know it's really actually depressing.
Tim: We might have a confrontation right here.
Ryan: I'm the worst guy to want to go out to meals with or to have over to your house. It's just better if I stay home.
Tim: Oh my gosh. [crosstalk 00:43:06] Wait, pity party round two, let's calm down, okay?
Chris: I'm just going to have some chicken and salad.
Ryan: We can meet for drinks, appetizers, but don't invite [crosstalk 00:43:09]
Tim: Drinks? How do you do drinks?
Ryan: I just-
Tim: There's sugar in drinks.
Ryan: Yeah, so after I've lost 130 pounds. There's things... I have not given up coffee creamer.
Tim: Right.
Ryan: I just won't do it.
Tim: Right.
Ryan: And it doesn't seem to make me gain weight. But I go to hot yoga every other day, I eat super clean. But if I want to have a drink here and there.
Tim: Yeah. Okay.
Ryan: Like whiskey every night.
Tim: Yeah. Right, right.
Ryan: I'm just kidding. [Crosstalk 00:43:40] But I do [crosstalk 00:43:40]
Tim: Two whiskey whiskeys every night. [crosstalk 00:43:41]
Emmoe: We're like, "That sounds normal."
Ryan: If I want three doubles every night,
Tim: Yeah, don't look behind you.
Chris: Don't do that.
Ryan: But give me the frozen yogurt one.
Chris: [crosstalk 00:43:51] I want dream a little bit.
Ryan: Please. I want to [crosstalk 00:43:55]
Tim: So this is just, I have a real curiosity. If you're going Froyo, and I'm not talking Golden Spoon, I'm talking... Well, I guess you could... Did you guys ever hear of Golden Spoon?
Ryan: Never.
Tim: That's like a California thing. Did you have it up in the upper? Okay, I'm just kidding. So if you ever went to froyo, if you ever would eat such a sinful thing, would you get,a sweet and sour, or would you get kind of chocolatey, or would you do both?
Ryan: No, never sweet and sour. I don't like fruity flavored any kind of ice cream or sugary stuff.
Chris: We're so good.
Ryan: It's got to be like vanilla or chocolate or like cookie dough.
Tim: Yeah.
Chris: Okay.
Tim: Yeah.
Ryan: It's got to be like [crosstalk 00:44:34] a creamy. Yes.
Tim: Okay, that's your deal.
Ryan: I can't do fruit tart flavored anything.
Chris: Reese's?
Tim: Yeah. I say, I say both Reese's Reesey's Reesey's buttercup.
Chris: It just sounds weird.
Ryan: I'm just going to do you a favor. You can keep asking questions.
Tim: Do you have an answer for that Chris?
Chris: Yeah, because it's so obvious. It's plain vanilla ice cream.
Tim: Not tart?
Chris: No, plain vanilla, strawberries on top with some granola. You need a little crunch, and if I'm feeling crazy, I'm going to put like a little chunk of Sneaker Bar or maybe like a gummy worm. You know what I mean? Just as a garnish.
Emmoe: For looks.
Tim: On top of the strawberries?
Chris: Yeah. I want to eat that separately, really. I'm not going to like dive it in. I'm just going to be like, "Uuh, I want to enjoy it, buy that and then dive in."
Tim: No I'm with Emmoe, what do you do?
Emmoe: Oh my goodness. I just go with chocolate chip cookie dough, every time.
Ryan: There it is, my girl.
Emmoe: If I see it-
Tim: Do you put toppings on it?
Emmoe: Mm-mm (negative) Then I go grab a snack later. The toppings are a whole different experience. I do the ice cream, then I go buy the gummy bear.
Ryan: There is something about chocolate chip cookie dough.
Tim: Yeah. Yeah. Magical.
Ryan: You can't... That's never going to be-
Chris: I'd rather get just the cookie dough and eat it.
Tim: Yes. That's a true statement. I love my cookies. I think mine is really indicative of my anagram persuasion. I get two sides. I get like tart with strawberries or whatever on one side of my little bowl. And then I get some kind of chocolatey something [crosstalk 00:46:16] because I'm like, I can't miss out. [crosstalk 00:46:18] I don't want to miss out [crosstalk 00:46:21]
Chris: Wow.
Tim: [inaudible 00:46:24] It's seven. That's my seven, I'm like going... I might miss out.
Chris: [crosstalk 00:46:28] See I just know that everybody in my family's going to have a little something. So I'm like, I can get a bite of that.
Emmoe: Oh my goodness.
Chris: Get a bite of this.
Tim: Speaking of a bite of this.
Chris: Oh, sorry.
Tim: Ryan is just showing us a picture of him pre now.
Ryan: Well, I was only [crosstalk 00:46:44] I was only 275.
Tim: Then what were you at other points?
Ryan: 300.
Tim: Wow.
Ryan: That was right outside of a Coldstone, so.
Tim: Wow.
Ryan: In Southern California.
Tim: This came full circle, everybody. Ryan, thank you.
Chris: With the bleached hair.
Ryan: Yeah buddy.
Tim: Thank you so much.
Tim: Yes, that's the bleached hair.
Chris: Bleached hair, earrings.
Tim: Gosh.
Ryan: My mother, God rest her soul. When I came home with tattoos, my parents turned me loose to college. I went away for three months. Two and a half hours away, I come home. I'm tatted up, bleached hair, earrings, a tongue ring. My mom and dad met me at a Chinese restaurant in Eugene, Oregon, right by UVO. And I went down there to see him and I walked into the Chinese restaurant and my mom just started sobbing.
Chris: Aw, Aw.
Ryan: And I'll never forget that. And my dad's like just that look of like [inaudible 00:47:39]
Tim: Yeah.
Emmoe: Dang.
Ryan: What happened to you?
Tim: Oh God.
Ryan: My mom's like, "Oh my gosh, my baby." So, I don't know what any of that meant. [crosstalk 00:47:51] Just thankful for it.
Tim: Were you a large child? Were you large as a kid?
Ryan: No, I was super skinny, and I have a weird... and I'll just end with this, I didn't puberty until I was 19. So I grew normally till about the sixth grade and then junior high happened, so I come back into the seventh grade, all of my friends are like leaning out and getting yoked up. And they're becoming men, they're going through their growth spurts. And I stayed that sixth grade kid till my freshman year of college.
Tim: Wow.
Ryan: So I have a very brutally tormented high school experience.
Tim: That shaped you for sure.
Ryan: So when people are like, "I'm being bullied." Maybe... Listen, I promise you. I was in high school before the days where we even really called it bullying. Yeah. I was terrorized by this... So like,
Chris: Is there anybody you want to call out right now on the podcast by name?
Ryan: You know what.
Tim: I love that you're thinking about it.
Emmoe: I'm going to have to jump in and say [crosstalk 00:49:02] practicing the presence right now.
Tim: Yeah, let's practice the presence. [crosstalk 00:49:05]
Emmoe: We're practicing the wrong presence.
Tim: Well, next time we have you on, we're going to talk about how that shaped you.
Chris: And we are going to have few of your high school friends join us. It's going to be great.
Ryan: In all honesty, that experience played... plays into every single thing we talked about today.
Tim: Yes, for sure.
Ryan: I can relate every issue, or thought process, or perspective, or paradigm shaping thing in my life to seventh grade.
Chris: Wow.
Ryan: I can.
Tim: Gosh. Next episode's going to be great. Froyo is going to be flowing. It's going to be at froyo place. So we'll do it there.
Ryan: I love y'all.
Tim: Thank you.
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